UT 01
2017-10-27 - created - Friday 10 AM PC
2017-10-27 - modified - Friday 1 PM MDNH
.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1521862661370506/permalink/2024648014425299/?comment_id=2024915931065174&reply_comment_id=2024916644398436¬if_id=1509076223045987¬if_t=group_comment
.
https://steemit.com/education/@joeyarnoldvn/unreliable-teacher
.
Really
don’t understand why a lot of “English teachers” are sooo unreliable.
Most of the time, the excuses are food poisoning, flat tires, emergency
business, blah blah...
Think about it if you work at other kinds of jobs, like bankers, office jobs... or even as teachers, I mean REAL teachers, would you just call in the office twice a week and ask for a day off for the above reasons? I don’t think so. Then why are you doing this with a teaching job here? Is that because you don’t respect the people you work with, or is that a habit of losers? Don’t get me wrong, there are also a lot of excellent teachers, and we always respect and want to work with them. The point here is, if you want to be respected, act respectfully.
Think about it if you work at other kinds of jobs, like bankers, office jobs... or even as teachers, I mean REAL teachers, would you just call in the office twice a week and ask for a day off for the above reasons? I don’t think so. Then why are you doing this with a teaching job here? Is that because you don’t respect the people you work with, or is that a habit of losers? Don’t get me wrong, there are also a lot of excellent teachers, and we always respect and want to work with them. The point here is, if you want to be respected, act respectfully.
Comments
Matthew Johnson You
gotta keep in mind this is a bit of a fringe job from a western
perspective. You’ll get a lot of cool people but a lot of people who
don’t fit in for much more negative reasons back home too! I agree with
your thesis though!
Remove
Write a reply...
Sherwin Ralph Casiple Its
not about the teachers, its about your RECRUITMENT PROCESS and also its
about what you called MARKET or in marketing its simply called supply
and demand.
If you just hire anyone , and dont care about who they are, just because you want to supply according to the number of demands.. then this is the result. If you really want to work with good teachers, go for the qualifications and then authentications of yhe qualifications just make sure the degrees or diplomas are not fake then experiences..
Dont forget as well to check if theyre fit to the class that they wanna teach. Some teachers are good in childrens and some are good in teens or adults.. so you cant fit those teachers to children if they re good in teaching adults.
RemoveIf you just hire anyone , and dont care about who they are, just because you want to supply according to the number of demands.. then this is the result. If you really want to work with good teachers, go for the qualifications and then authentications of yhe qualifications just make sure the degrees or diplomas are not fake then experiences..
Dont forget as well to check if theyre fit to the class that they wanna teach. Some teachers are good in childrens and some are good in teens or adults.. so you cant fit those teachers to children if they re good in teaching adults.
Philippe Lainé I
agree with it and have to admit that I was surprised at the beginning
to see that recruiters were seeing their job like a supply company.
Sorry, for the unprofessional teachers. If you need help on it I'd be
happy to offer my service... But it means that I might be critical and
suggest strongly some changes.
Remove
Sherwin Ralph Casiple Exactly... they should hire base on the qualifications and experience and not through skin color..
Remove
Philippe Lainé But
also consider the motivation of the person recruited. It's important to
understand how people are functioning . What is the motivation behind
the job? Why are they here. It's never 100% safe, but reduce the risk of
having immature people who are no...See More
Remove
Sherwin Ralph Casiple Yes..
agree.. and i suggest go for the teachers who are passionate and
dedicated to the job. Most likely, teachers that has the passion are
more on quality teaching than money. They would love to stay in the
school, doing more work to improve its teaching quality or make some
teaching materials to let their students understand more.
Remove
Philippe Lainé The
sad truth is that parents want white people. And I guess schools and
agencies don't dare so much to explain them that they could have many
great non white teachers when, because of the high demand, the risk of
having bad white teachers is certainly higher.
Remove
Devin Monaghan "Hey, I was almost late today, but luckily, my university degree saved me," said no one ever.
Remove
Saliba Memon Philippe
Lainé Agreed. It may or not be widely known but at least at the
language mill here I'm familiar with, parents pay more for double doses
of whitey. The corporate driven schools make more money for hiring white
people. I'm not sure about other s...See More
Remove
Jonathan Neal I
worked in Vietnam on and off for almost six years. For being non-white,
I was lucky enough to have had a very good experience there, but I am
also highly qualified-- experience, CELTA, grad school, very near to
completing my DELTA, and attended a top...See More
Remove
Sherwin Ralph Casiple Awesome
mate.. thats should ot be.. youre one of those 5% teachers that has a
good qualifications.. in my first few years i experience those kind of
things as well even if i have bachelor and diploma in education.. i
have even masters degree in TESOL ...See More
Remove
Saliba Memon Jonathan Neal
It's good to hear that you had a good experience. FWIW, I know an
African American teaching here at a lesser known language school and
they seem to love him.He's doing great and that bodes well for all of us
on some level. Good luck.
Remove
Jonathan Neal Saliba Memon
I'm glad to hear it. Some people out there are trailblazers and that
does bodes well for everyone. Myself on the other hand, I don't want the
responsibility of being "the black teacher"-- of being some language
school's magic negro/experim...See More
Remove
Jonathan Neal Saliba Memon
I'm glad to hear it. Some people out there are trailblazers and that
does bode well for everyone. Myself, on the other hand, I don't want the
responsibility of being "the black teacher"-- of being some language
school's magic negro/experim...See More
Remove
Write a reply...
Write a reply...
Matthew Johnson learning how to properly ride a bike/do proper maintenance mitigates that problem generally.
Remove
Philippe Lainé I
don't think that her problem is the one flat tire that can happen. It's
the repetition of excuses like this one that makes it sound like BS.
Remove
Write a reply...
Marcus Stulak Well,
to be fair, I told you 4 times I was available for you, confirmed it on
a phone call, and you ''cancelled on me'' without telling me at all,
then that Saturday morning at 0600 asked If I was still coming because
other ''teachers'' you decided to choose cancelled on you. Next time,
stick with someone who has confirmed with you 5 times that they are
coming, that means they are ''SERIOUS''.
Remove
Marcus Stulak She
chose other people over me after I told her 5 times then asked if I was
still coming after she got stiffed, it's called ''Karma''
Remove
Marcus Stulak yeah, Karma, had I not checked again I would've went there and been told this in person, but yet, she posts this. Karma.
Remove
David Walsh i see she didnt come back and comment on this comment. bit hypocritical
Remove
Marcus Stulak yeah, esp. my comment, she ''totally'' ditched me w no notice then got ditched then tried to still get me to come, AH, NOO
Remove
Write a reply...
Louis Barber Corallo What is your recruitment process? I get the feeling that you should review that if this is a common issue for you.
Remove
Vitaly Chetverikov I
suspect that the underlying principle of their work is that any white
native speaker of English is good to teach at any school in Saigon.
Remove
Write a reply...
Marcus Stulak she talks act respectively, but yet, I was totally disrespected, how hypocritical is that? wow.
Remove
Write a reply...
Marcus Stulak Indeed.............pretty faces aren't reliable faces, just sayin, then u get burned.
Remove
Write a reply...
Sebastian Lehmann but
then you would normally review that before taking any job right? I do
agree the OP has a point. In my experience if you respect the job and
put in the professionalism then the center/school does as well. Ive been
cancelled on but they always reimbursed because they realised that was
on them so I didn't mind.
Remove
Lorin Barrett You
decided to be an immigrant in this country. Why not accept the way they
do things and try to change it to western standards? Take it or leave
it
Remove
Lorin Barrett But lot of people prefer to stay here an keep complaining. They should be honest with themselves and leave, like you
Remove
Joey Arnold Lorin Barrett
it goes both ways. Foreigners can try to accept Vietnam culture and
everything, including the work. On the other hand, Vietnamese could
maybe try harder to maybe sometimes adopt foreign culture, rules, ways
of doing things, ideas, and so on. Vietnamese can do what they want but
they are already accepting some western culture, ways of doing things,
and so on. It is not like Vietnamese are not trying to change.
Vietnamese kind of say sometimes they are trying to be like other
countries. So, if that is true, then they could maybe sometimes benefit
from taking some advice from foreigners. It is very simple. Vietnamese
are not really saying they hate Europe, the USA, Australia, the west,
their people, their stuff. You know. Maybe sometimes. But logically it
seems that if Vietnamese are trying to be more like the west, then they
should then try more to be like west if they are in fact trying to be a
little bit more like the west.........
Manage
Write a reply...
Anna Buslaeva Vietnamese
schools and centres hire anyone. The person doesn't speak English well,
has no degree or education, but they are handsome. Welcome!!! They
drink or smoke weed with the parents of their students and...their
salary is risen up!!! They don't want
you to be a perfect teacher, they want you only to smile and be white.
Nobody cares about your education, certificates and experience. Just be
an idiot and you win. That's the secret how to get a job in Vietnam
Remove
Louis Barber Corallo I rather get a job because I am handsome than just buy the job like a lot of people do in Vietnam.
Remove
Write a reply...
Joe George Some
people here don't care about how they act on the job. They will do
stupid stuff like no show to classes, make ridiculous excuses or quit
with zero notice because they feel that it will have zero impact on
their career opportunities in their home country or other countries.
Remove
Mark Double Very true........after all the job is far too simple for an average graduate....it is just a gap fill
Remove
Mark Double A really convenient way of funding an extended trip in South east Asia!!!
Remove
Write a reply...
Mark Double The bottom line is does the teaching lead to alcoholism or the alcoholism leads to teaching?
Remove
Write a reply...
Aidan Alburo Because
Vietnam does not care about dedicated and educated teachers. All you
care about is skin colour and now you are whining. Suck it up
Remove
Tim Kim Sa In my experience, Vietnam does care about educated and dedicated teachers.
Remove
Write a reply...
Mark Double An
inetilligent person with a degree from a reutable university should not
be teaching kids in a language centre. This will lead to substance
abuse!
Remove
Mark Double most
backpackers are too intellectual to teach in language
centres...unfortunately they need the cash to continue with their
travels
Remove
Rob Sheppard There
is most likely a very good reason for the pattern that you are
noticing, one that I would think you could figure out yourself if you
think for a minute about it.
What type of person tends to take the type of job you are talking about? At what stage in their lives are they? Have they had jobs as bankers or in offices? What do you think their priorities are? What drew them to these jobs?
RemoveWhat type of person tends to take the type of job you are talking about? At what stage in their lives are they? Have they had jobs as bankers or in offices? What do you think their priorities are? What drew them to these jobs?
Aidan Alburo Lol they don’t bother pondering those questions. As long as you are white, you’re on board.
Remove
Rob Sheppard Aidan Alburo
I know. But this person is puzzled as to what they've got a bunch of
irresponsible employees and I'd say there's really not much mystery
there if you start asking these questions.
Remove
Liza Callaghan And
majority of them aren't even qualified ESL teachers with degree and
other teaching certificates , they're just backpackers and travelling
around Vietnam.for fun . Why would they take the job seriously ? 
😜
No commitment & dedication but they get higher rates compared to
those who are "REAL " teachers because they are white . Racism sucks !
Remove😜
No commitment & dedication but they get higher rates compared to
those who are "REAL " teachers because they are white . Racism sucks !
Rob Sheppard Joey Arnold Yes. Paying less qualified foreign teachers more than highly qualified Vietnamese ESL teachers is pretty much textbook racism.
Remove
Joey Arnold Rob
Sheppard racism or profiling? Historically, we can see differences in
the IQ, in the things that happened.... on average, we can see certain
patterns...... some alleged racism is not racism.... the term racism is
used too much and too often....
Manage
Rob Sheppard Joey Arnold Wow. Just, wow.
Yeah, maybe "some alleged racism is not racism." But "historically we can see differences in the IQ"—that is one of the vilest forms of racism.
RemoveYeah, maybe "some alleged racism is not racism." But "historically we can see differences in the IQ"—that is one of the vilest forms of racism.
Write a reply...
Mark Double Personally I love and appreciate the low cost of living in Vietnam
Remove
Mark Double The only aspect I loathe is the rainy season so I leave for 4 months of the year
Remove
Pten Prudente Your
industry built this culture, not the teachers (if you could even call
most of them that). NES know they hold the cards, you dealt it to them.
And when you actually find dedicated teachers, NES or not, a lot of
schools (especially those with dodgy recruiters) don't really know how
to treat teachers well.
Remove
Mark Double If
you consider the average Vietnamese graduate makes 500 bucks a month
and the average so called English teacher makes 1800 bucks a month....it
doesn' t take a genius to work it out
Remove
To Thuy Anh Nope nope nope. Average Vietnamese graduate to make ~ 4 million, which means 180 bucks a month. Been proved T.T
Remove
Mark Double ım not talking about starting salary ım talking about all graduates
Remove
To Thuy Anh Me
too Mark. And actually their salaries are about 4 to 6 million a month,
never 10 million. 10 million is more like a leader/manager position
already.
Remove
Joey Arnold The
average is around 200 to $500USD/mo and averages kind of change from
time to time.... the lower end of the average is often below
200.........
Manage
Write a reply...
Vitaly Chetverikov I
haven't been teaching long, just over 3 years, but during this time I
have never called in sick or missed a lesson. This doesn't mean that
I've never been sick or never had problems that made it difficult for me
to be in class. It means I take my obligations
seriously. The thing is, I expect my employers to take their
obligations just as seriously—and it so happens that this kind of
employer is the rarest beast in Vietnam.
Before complaining about your teachers, take a good look at yourself. I don't know you or your school/agency/dispatch company, but here are some questions to consider:
1. Do you pay your teachers well? Can they actually afford to maintain a healthy lifestyle so as not to get sick?
2. Do you have reasonable expectations in terms of hours, workload, etc.?
3. Do you provide all the legal paperwork that you are supposed to provide by law?
4. What kind of benefits do you provide? Is there medical insurance on the list? If your teachers get sick, do they pay for the necessary medical treatment out of their pocket?
5. Finally, do you always honor your own obligations?
You see, if you're the sort of outfit that provides no insurance, no paid holiday, no housing, no legal support, no guaranteed minimum number of teaching hours per month and assumes that your hourly rate compensates for all of that, then you basically admit that you have zero responsibility towards your employees and are only looking to make a quick buck. If that's your main concern, why do you expect your teachers to think differently?
RemoveBefore complaining about your teachers, take a good look at yourself. I don't know you or your school/agency/dispatch company, but here are some questions to consider:
1. Do you pay your teachers well? Can they actually afford to maintain a healthy lifestyle so as not to get sick?
2. Do you have reasonable expectations in terms of hours, workload, etc.?
3. Do you provide all the legal paperwork that you are supposed to provide by law?
4. What kind of benefits do you provide? Is there medical insurance on the list? If your teachers get sick, do they pay for the necessary medical treatment out of their pocket?
5. Finally, do you always honor your own obligations?
You see, if you're the sort of outfit that provides no insurance, no paid holiday, no housing, no legal support, no guaranteed minimum number of teaching hours per month and assumes that your hourly rate compensates for all of that, then you basically admit that you have zero responsibility towards your employees and are only looking to make a quick buck. If that's your main concern, why do you expect your teachers to think differently?
Write a reply...
Mark Double The
person doing the hiring should have more experience and a higher
education then the preson they are hiring. This is the root of the
probem!!!
Remove
Mark Double To
employ professional teachers the ownewrs/management of the school would
need a masters degree in education from a Wester University
Remove
Aidan Alburo Has to be from a western university? Lol do you not recognise the good universities in Japan and in Singapore?
Remove
Mark Double The heads of the Japanese and Chinese schools in hcmc have Phds
Remove
Rob Sheppard Why
exactly do you believe that only someone with an advanced degree from a
western university could "employ professional teachers"? Am I missing
something here?
Remove
Write a reply...
Nguyễn Thu Giang I know that feeling when work with the guys who don’t have any responsibility. Really want to punch them and kick them out of vn
Remove
Vitaly Chetverikov Too bad there's no one to punch dishonest and irresponsible employers and kick them out of Vietnam.
Remove
Nguyễn Thu Giang Vitaly Chetverikov
yes i know. But when they made me have to explain to students parents
and got so much stress because of their fault. I know i cant punch them
and kick them out of vn . Those words just describe my feelings
Remove
Write a reply...
Marcus Stulak I'm ex military, I'm ALWAYS on time and reliable and I hold people to the same regard.
Remove
Vitaly Chetverikov Problem is, Marcus, the playing field is not even. They can hold you accountable but you can't.
Remove
Louis Barber Corallo I
managed to disappoint my students into coming on time. For the others,
well some very creatively tedious homework does the trick.
Remove
Write a reply...
Phan Nguyen Remember
that, the worst in our country is attracting the worst people in the
world, girl. I dont mention all of them but the ratio.
Remove
Mark Double I have noticed that many Vietnamese teachers chat on their phones during class time! Who thinks this is acceptable behaviour?
.
.
No comments:
Post a Comment